If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Post all your ideas for trade proposals and signings to improve the Knicks or other NBA teams.

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If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 30, 2017, 6:45 pm

If I was GM for the day this is my trade you have heard it before KP and Melo to Boston for J. Crowder, J. Brown Brooklyn's pick this year and the next. Who would I draft Fultz at one and D. Smith at 8 along with J. Brown and Willy gives 4 out of 5 starters and sets us up to compete in 3 years What would U do?
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby n8 the gr8 » May 30, 2017, 7:30 pm

I posted my trades of choice on the armchair gm board but I'd try to get Parker and 2 late future first rounders from San Antonio and Boston for Melo in a 4-team trade. Then I'd try to get a future 1st for taking on Chandler Parsons for Lee. Then I'd shop O'Quinn and draft Frank. Then you'd have a barebones core of Frank/KP/Willy with 3 future firsts incoming.

There is absolutely no way Ainge gives up both of NJ's picks for Melo.
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 30, 2017, 10:25 pm

Not for Melo but KP Boston always been a town that loves it's Basketball players and this is not gonna sound politically correct but especially there white ones Your draft picks are all bottom of the round picks those aren't picks you build around If Porzingis was in this draft right now with what we know about his play already he would be far and away the top pick in this draft What I'm asking the Celtics to do is trade two future unknowns for what is already known KP is an all-star waiting to happen nobody knows what Fultz is yet
















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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby Irv » May 30, 2017, 10:48 pm

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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby nazrmohamed » May 30, 2017, 11:59 pm

And I love it
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby Don Che » May 31, 2017, 12:45 am

Melo and Kyle for aminu/turner 20th and 27th.

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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 8:38 am

So Don Che your idea of a trade that goanna reboot this franchise is to acquire two players that have been in this league 7 years and are the very definition of mediocre (there PPG is 9) and two lower first round picks that if where lucky become bench players lol WTF does no one on this site aim high any longer????? Look all I've heard on this site is how wrong I've been wrong for wanting to draft KP over Okafor and Winslow wrong for saying Melo needed to be traded while he still had value wrong for saying signing Rose and Noah was akin to acquiring more shit wrong for saying we overpaid for a bit player like Lopez wrong for saying Derek Fisher sucked and following up with Rambis was a joke wrong for saying that triangle needs to be done and buried but most of all wrong for saying Phil is an unbending egotistical dunce who collecting a big paycheck and except for KP (who he didn't want) everything he has done has turn to shit. Wrong, yeah I'm tired at being so Wrong :)
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby Rusty La Rue » May 31, 2017, 10:24 am

vino92 wrote:So Don Che your idea of a trade that goanna reboot this franchise is to acquire two players that have been in this league 7 years and are the very definition of mediocre (there PPG is 9) and two lower first round picks that if where lucky become bench players lol WTF does no one on this site aim high any longer????? Look all I've heard on this site is how wrong I've been wrong for wanting to draft KP over Okafor and Winslow wrong for saying Melo needed to be traded while he still had value wrong for saying signing Rose and Noah was akin to acquiring more shit wrong for saying we overpaid for a bit player like Lopez wrong for saying Derek Fisher sucked and following up with Rambis was a joke wrong for saying that triangle needs to be done and buried but most of all wrong for saying Phil is an unbending egotistical dunce who collecting a big paycheck and except for KP (who he didn't want) everything he has done has turn to shit. Wrong, yeah I'm tired at being so Wrong :)


Okay vino92 calm down... at least Don Che trade might actually happen and we keep KP...

And before you start high fiving yourself... let me just say that the Rose trade was a gamble worth taking, I would love to still have Lopez on that contract and the triangle is not the issue.
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby nazrmohamed » May 31, 2017, 11:30 am

Yeah Vino. Don seems to have made a very self aware trade in regards to Melos value and was able to do so without Sacraficing KP. Do big trades happen? Sure but when the knicks are involved we get hosed. I rather trade Anthony by himself and if all we get are two later furst rounder, I guess im ready to settle for that and just move on.

We walk out of the draft keeping KP, and have 3 picks to choose from. Could even flip Aminu and the two later picks to move into the mid to lower teens.
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 11:45 am

Naz If that all we can get for Melo whats the point it doesn't bring anything to forward this franchise You do know we have no draft pick next year so if we continue on this course where goanna be behind everyone including Philly If we have no faith in Phil not getting nested by Ainge then why in hell is he GM If that's the best we can do then don't trade him move KP to center Melo to PF start Kuzminkas at SF draft D. Smith with Lee at SG ditch the triangle and let this team run Let it at least play to it strength's
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby H20Knick » May 31, 2017, 12:02 pm

I've said it before, and im going to say it every time someone tries to propose it...

Melo will not go to portland
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 12:06 pm

I agree the only places he will accept are LA Boston Cleveland maybe Miami never Portland
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby n8 the gr8 » May 31, 2017, 12:10 pm

Until we hear otherwise I think Portland, Miami, Washington and Chicago are all maybes. Melo's agent will talk to him about how even if he wants to resign with wherever that opting out of his deal a year from now may make sense just to get a longer contract and a season isn't that long. If Lillard roles out the carpet for him Melo would seriously consider it.
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby H20Knick » May 31, 2017, 12:49 pm

n8 the gr8 wrote:Until we hear otherwise I think Portland, Miami, Washington and Chicago are all maybes. Melo's agent will talk to him about how even if he wants to resign with wherever that opting out of his deal a year from now may make sense just to get a longer contract and a season isn't that long. If Lillard roles out the carpet for him Melo would seriously consider it.


I don't get how you lump Portland in with Miami/Chicago/Washington. Miami has Pat Riley and it's Miami. Washington is closest to his hometown and they're good enough to challenge Cleveland with Melo. Chicago has his bff DWade.

Portland has none of these. If Melo goes to Portland, maybe they go from 0-4 against GSW to 2-4 against GSW, but they're nowhere close to winning and who wants to live in Portland?
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 12:58 pm

If these are the best deals we can come up with lol then how in hell are we criticizing Phil is the only vision everyone has to reboot this Franchise is to trade Melo for Drek??? Come on you can do better than that also how apart part two of the question who would you draft
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby H20Knick » May 31, 2017, 3:02 pm

vino92 wrote:If these are the best deals we can come up with lol then how in hell are we criticizing Phil is the only vision everyone has to reboot this Franchise is to trade Melo for Drek??? Come on you can do better than that also how apart part two of the question who would you draft


We're criticizing Phil because Phil is the reason we don't have any useful assets to facilitate the franchise reboot. Phil took Iman Shumpert and JR Smith and traded them away for career journeymen (2 2 of which aren't on the roster anymore) and a 2019 2nd round pick from Cleveland (which might as well not even be a draft pick). We're talking 2 guys that get burn in the NBA finals and we couldnt even get 1 lone first rounder out of the deal.
Inputs: Two guys who play big minutes on a finals team. Output: Lance Thomas

Phil took Tyson Chandler (who starts for the Suns) and Ray Felton (who plays 20ppg for the Clippers) and sold them off for Samuel Dalembert (who he cut), Shane Larkin (who we let walk after a year), Jose Calderon (i'll get to this in a second), Wayne Ellington (who we traded along with a 2016 pick and jeremy tyler for quincy acy and travis outlaw... neither of which are with us), and 2 2nd rounders that ended up being Cleanthony Early (currently in DLeague, not affiliated with Knicks) and Thanasis (currently playing in Greece).
Inputs: Former DPOY/current NBA starter, 20mpg guy on a western conference playoff team. Output: Jose Calderon... (kind of)

Phil took Tim Hardaway Jr. who played 27mpg during the regular season and 33mpg during the playoffs for Atlanta and flipped him for Jerian Grant, who played 16mpg during the regular season and 10 mpg during the playoffs for the Bulls. He took Jerian Grant and Jose Calderon. Phil signed Robin Lopez, who despite not being a good rebounder, is a solid young center. But then he traded Jerian Grant, Jose Calderon, and Robin Lopez for a 1 year rental of derrick rose and justin holiday
Inputs: A young role playing guard, a solid starting quality center, the return on the investment of Tyson Chandler and Ray Felton. Outputs: Justin Holiday. Yes, Derrick Rose is a free agent. So our only output is Justin Holiday.

Phil Jackson managed to turn tyson chandler, ray felton, tim hardaway jr, iman shumpert, and jr smith.... into justin holiday. IN THREE YEARS! You want us to sit here and talk about WINNING trades when we've Phil has been royally sodomized on every trade he's been involved in.

--------------------------------

To answer your question.... every time I see this thread and try to answer, I get depressed and close the tab. This roster is so far from being competitive that I can't even rationalize how I'd fix it. Getting the 8th pick blows. DSJ/Monk/Isaac/Frank all have the potential to be the 3rd best player on a championship team, I think. But we don't have an alpha-guard and that bothers me. So to answer your question, I'd trade KP for Fultz straight up. I don't think it's realistic to expect any more in return than that. It's a guaranteed B player for a potential superstar guard. In a guard's league, I gotta do it.

1. Then, the next question becomes what to do with Melo. I think I lean towards Boston. I think KP and Melo can get you Fultz, Jaylen Smith, and Boston's 2018 pick (NOT the nets 2018 pick, that's not realistic). Remember, next year's NJ pick isn't a swap. They have their own pick AND boston's. Boston's should end up being in the 20-25 range. I'll take it. Smith should be a great defender and hopefully, his 3pt percentage improves. Plus, he's 20 years old. So it works well with my Fultz dependent timeline. Smith and a 2018 early 20s pick is better than anything I can realistically see us getting from Cleveland, LAC, or GSW.

2. In dreamland, I go to the Lakers and I get DeAngelo Russell and Julius Randle for Melo. I'm not even big fans of those two guys, but they're young, they COULD work out, and they'll still have trade value next summer. But the Lakers aren't going to be contenders next year, so they can just wait for Melo to become a free agent.

3. This brings me to my darkhorse move. Melo for Otto Porter. The Wizards would absolutely be contenders with Melo on the roster IMO. But they can't afford to get Melo and resign Porter. Now, I know i'm the one who has vehemently said the Wizards will keep Porter because he's a GTown product which means he's ottomatically (LOL) a fan favorite. He defends, he plays his role well, and he's just a good guy. But with all of that said, Kelly Oubre is waiting in the wings and probably has a higher ceiling because he can create his own offense. The Wizards roster is perfectly set up to accomodate Melo. They can run traditional lineups of Melo/Morris/Gortat. They can run smaller lineups of Oubre/Melo/Gortat. They can play small-ball with Oubre/Melo/Morris. Moreover, Oubre and Morris are the kind of guys who wont bitch about Melo taking their minutes or changing their roles. The internet is ablaze with the history of how shitty Melo's PGs have been in his tenure here. Billups and KMart have both made statements about how much Melo needs a good pg to make him a better winner. Wall does that 100%. It's a perfect fit really. However, i'm ONLY doing this if we end up with Fultz or Fox. Porter can't create his own offense at all. He needs a guy who can find him coming off screens or when he sneaks to open spots (sorry DSJ) and he needs a guy who can breakdown defenses and cause the mayhem that gets him open (sorry Frank). So i'm only going for Porter if we get Fultz or Fox.
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 3:51 pm

Ok H20Knick finally someone with a vision I've been saying for awhile that our best trade partner is Boston but unlike you I believe KP is worth more than just Boston no. 1 pick this year there are no guarantees when you draft a 19 y/o they may turn out to be KP or Okafor and Russell or sometime worse if I'm gonna give everything his team need a go to scorer in Melo to pair with Thomas and the Big Man with the most upside in the nba then his goanna have to part with young talent and draft picks to me that means J. Brown and the Brooklyn pick this year and next And this is why I think he will do it Boston has a lot of good players but only 1 star Isaiah say what you want about Melo but he's still a 24 ppg player that can get his own shot If Boston starting 5 consisted of Porzingis, Melo, Crowder Bradley and Smart with Horford as your 6th man Do you think that team can compete with the Cav's? I do so what I'm asking for in return is fair. there is one other team to look at and that Philly but the trade chip isn't Melo but KP I live down here now and talk radio is exploding with the idea of trading for KP and here the scenario that gets tossed around KP to Philly for Saric Philly drat pick (no. 3) and the rights to LA pick next year. I would then take the 3rd pick in the draft and try to trade it to Sacramento plus our 2019 pick for there 5th and 10 pick in this year draft So I would have Saric at PF Willy at center and with the 3 draft picks this year our 8th plus Sacramento 5th and 10th I would draft these 3 players to fill out my starting 5 5th pick Fox 8th pick Isaac and the 10th pick Ntilikina Our staring 5 Willy Saric Isaac Fox Ntilikina that Boys and Girls is a REBOOTH!!!!!!!
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby nazrmohamed » May 31, 2017, 5:59 pm

vino92 wrote:Naz If that all we can get for Melo whats the point it doesn't bring anything to forward this franchise You do know we have no draft pick next year so if we continue on this course where goanna be behind everyone including Philly If we have no faith in Phil not getting nested by Ainge then why in hell is he GM If that's the best we can do then don't trade him move KP to center Melo to PF start Kuzminkas at SF draft D. Smith with Lee at SG ditch the triangle and let this team run Let it at least play to it strength's


What? Im pretty sure I read we have all our first rounders going forward
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby vino92 » May 31, 2017, 6:24 pm

Your right Naz my Bad I thought LAC had the right to swamp with us but that a second round pick lol what can I say fire me as GM :) Wait a sec doesn't that make the trade with Boston or Philly more attractive if it gets us two number 1's in 2018? ours and LA?
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Re: If U where GM 4 a day what trade would make who would U draft

Postby H20Knick » May 31, 2017, 6:29 pm

vino92 wrote:Ok H20Knick, finally someone with a vision. I've been saying for awhile that our best trade partner is Boston, but unlike you, I believe KP is worth more than just Boston no. 1 pick this year. There are no guarantees when you draft a 19 y/o. They may turn out to be KP or Okafor and Russell or sometime worse. Boston needs a go to scorer in Melo to pair with Thomas and the Big Man with the most upside in the nba. If I'm gonna give everything, then he's gonna have to part with young talent and draft picks. To me, that means J. Brown and the Brooklyn pick this year and next. This is why I think he will do it: Boston has a lot of good players but only 1 star, Isaiah. Say what you want about Melo, but he's still a 24 ppg player that can get his own shot. If Boston's starting 5 consisted of Porzingis, Melo, Crowder Bradley and Smart with Horford as your 6th man. Do you think that team can compete with the Cavs? I do, so what I'm asking for in return is fair.

There is one other team to look at, and that's Philly. But the trade chip isn't Melo, but KP. I live down here now and talk radio is exploding with the idea of trading for KP. Here, the scenario that gets tossed around is KP to Philly for Saric Philly draft pick (no. 3) and the rights to LA pick next year. I would then take the 3rd pick in the draft and our 2019 pick and try to trade it to Sacramento for their 5th and 10 pick in this year draft. So I would have Saric at PF, Willy at center, and with the 3 draft picks this year (our 8th, plus Sacramento 5th and 10th), I would draft these 3 players to fill out my starting 5. 5th pick Fox, 8th pick Isaac, and the 10th pick Ntilikina. Our staring 5: Willy, Saric, Isaac, Fox, Ntilikina. That Boys and Girls is a REBOOT!!!!!!!


Okay Vino. Do not take the following as an attack. I'm just explaining why I think your moves aren't realistic .



Well, for starters, the big man with the most upside in the nba is assuredly Karl Anthony Towns. You could argue AD is still pretty young. After that, many people would argue its Jokic. Historically, 1st picks that are guards dont end up being busts. Kyrie, Wall, Rose, Iverson, and Magic are the only 5 Guard #1 picks in the last 40 years. Crazy huh? They all ended up being studs. Rose, Iverson, and Magic have MVPs to their names and Wall and Kyrie may one day too. I wouldn't be willing to trade KP for Fultz alone if I wasn't extremely confident that he was going to become potential MVP/finals MVP/1st team all NBA type player. Of the 4 times we played Boston this year, KP missed one with injury, shot 33% from the field for one of them, finished another one with 1 rebound, 0 blocks, 0 assists in 28 minutes. So Boston has one good KP 22/12 game to look at positively. I dont think you give up two top 5 picks for that. I don't think you give up two top 5 picks for anyone. Kevin Love "only" got back Andrew Wiggins. I dont think KP projects to be tremendously better than Kevin Love. KP's a better shotblocker, Love's a much better rebounder. Love was more contender-ready from an experience standpoint and he was proven. He was coming off a 26 and 12 season at 25 years old. I dont see how Kevin Love gets you the 1st pick Andrew Wiggins, but KP is going to get you Fultz and ANOTHER top 5 pick. You can't find a precedent for that. Its just not realistic. When you consider that Cleveland already had 2 players better than anyone Boston's current roster, they could've afforded to have been even more reckless with their picks. Boston has a good GM, no uberstar player to force them to make trades, and they can get guys in FA. If you're going to use both picks, you might as well trade for Paul George instead.

In regards to Melo, Melo in combination with a pg only a few years removed from finals MVP was only worth Felton, Chandler, Gallinari, and Mozgov. I.e. Melo wasn't even worth a top 5 pick when his prime was coming up. He sure as heck isn't worth one now. Especially when we have zero leverage, we can't guarantee he's going to stay with the team we trade him too, and the team has to absorb a giant contract which will inevitably force them to give up more players than they would like to.

Yes, I buy that Isiah, Bradley, Melo, KP, Horford + Smart/Crowder off the bench would be able to beat the Cavs, but I think you can get more for those 2 picks and Jaylen Smith than KP and Melo. We're not the only team that would be interested in those picks. If Ainge will do it, obviously i'm on board. I just don't need the Nets pick to make the deal worth it for me.

-------

With regards to the Philly trade... absolutely not. Here's why. 1) DeAaron Fox probably will not make it to 5. If we give up KP and don't get back Fox, I'd hate Phil more than I hate Coach K. But I don't even take Fox over KP. I get why people are high on Fox. But he isn't Fultz and the Wall comparisons needed to stop when he showed up at the combine 30 pounds lighter than Wall was at the combine. Fox could end up being Brandon Jennings. Not to say that we shouldn't have taken Jennings all those years ago. But I'm not trading KP for De'Aaron Fox. Don Che and I have gone back and forth on this 1000 times. I always say that the Knicks need a 1st pick kind of guy and that theres no substitute for it. He thinks KP has that potential, I don't. But I don't think Fox does either, and so i'm not about to make what at BEST would be a lateral move and what at worst would be a fucking disaster. It'd also be hella hypotocritical of me to then advocate Saric, who is an even worse rebounder than KP is, a worse defender than KP is, but doesn't even shoot like KP does, and he's 2 years older than KP is.

I'm also really against trading our 2018 pick, because without Melo, we're going to be terrible and so our pick will probably be top 8 again. So you want me to trade this year's 3rd pick (i.e. guaranteed Fox) for a chance at Fox so that we can add Isaac and Frank. Okay. I get it. A Fox/Frank backcourt could end up being Wall/Beal if Fox gets way stronger and Frank develops into an off-ball scorer, but WHEN fox goes at 3rd or 4th, what do you do? Fox/Frank/Isaac/Saric/Willy. That's a really young team. It actually opens you up to a philly situation of too much youth, not enough structure, too much losing to develop anyone. I do worry that you can have too much youth at once. There has to be some sort of veteran leadership. Someone to teach, steady the ship, and keep guys in line. Moreover, what do you do if Fox goes 3rd or 4th and then Isaac goes at 6th or 7th. I just can't trade KP for a CHANCE at scenarios. I can trade him for Fultz because i KNOW what im getting and I love what im getting. I dont like anyone past Fultz enough to trade KP for. I dont even want Dario Saric at all much less for KP. I'm all about the youth movement, but putting an ncaa all star team on the court anchored by a couple euros just sounds like an awful awful idea. We need balance and a pipeline. Two picks this year. Two picks next year. It's a nice normal progression.
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