Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby spree#8 » February 7, 2018, 1:45 pm

Ingus wrote:I'm feeling hopelessness. Is that what it feels like to be a Knicks fan?

source: http://forums.nykfp.com/viewtopic.php?f ... 05#p679005
Ingus wrote:2 years have passed, nothing has changed. lol
Hell, with KP's injury and the Hernangomez trade... this feels worse than it did 2 years ago.


Why are you so down? Of course the KP injury is tragic news and I'm sad that he will be out for maybe a year, but the franchise is in a fine position going forward with all first-round picks for the next years on deck and some nice players already on the roster. No reason to feel bad. It won't work like this for us, but just remember that David Robinson's injury allowed the Spurs to tank for Tim Duncan which was in hindsight the best thing that ever happened to them and led to the Spurs being the most successful regular season team since then and winner of 5 championships. So maybe KP's injury allows us to get exactly the two higher draft picks this year and next we need. Maybe the team grows until KP comes back into a better situation without having to go through a tank next year. We will see.

It's a sad day, but not the end of the world.

We went through much darker times in the last 17 years.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 1:51 pm

Finally Spree,you have come to the dark side..Welcome

We need to stink,and we need to get lucky in the draft..

Regardless, we are back to square one
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby spree#8 » February 7, 2018, 1:52 pm

Minkaveli wrote:Sad day. But at least we have each other.


H20Knick wrote:Yep. that's exactly what it feels like to me. A real chance at back to back top 8 picks with KP coming back into it at the end. We need an elite floor general. We need an elite wing. KP can come back to be the Love/Bosh that puts us over the top. We have to draft well though. No Jan Veseleys. We have the chance to be Durant/Westbrook/Harden but with Dolan's pocketbook to keep them all on the same team


This is really an opportunity now, because where I felt before that it is important to try to win with KP so he and we can learn what he is, with him being out probably a year, next season might be a season we really can tank without having to worry about hindering KP's development. For this year it looks like pick 8 or 9 to me, because there are some really, really bad teams out there that might be hard to fall behind, but that can also be a good spot.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby spree#8 » February 7, 2018, 1:52 pm

taowave wrote:Finally Spree,you have come to the dark side..Welcome

We need to stink,and we need to get lucky in the draft..

Regardless, we are back to square one


Heh? :? I am where I always am. Analyzing the situation. Nothing is changing in my approach. I always talk about the right adjustments.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 1:58 pm

Spree,like it or not, know it or not,you have joined forces with the Evil Tank Brigade.Welcome..

spree#8 wrote:
Heh? :? I am where I always am. Analyzing the situation. Nothing is changing in my approach. I always talk about the right adjustments.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby spree#8 » February 7, 2018, 2:09 pm

taowave wrote:Spree,like it or not, know it or not,you have joined forces with the Evil Tank Brigade.Welcome..


Tao, I was probably on the tank brigade well before anyone among Knicks fans back in 2003. It's my saying that "in the NBA you have to chose, when to lose". So my approach hasn't changed a lick. The situation has because of an injury. That's all. I am pretty consistent. But you won't understand, because you like to argue and don't like to think clearly about my strategic approach. So whatever. Call it however you want to call it.

And BTW: if the team surprises us until KP comes back, I still won't be mad. We are not doomed. Maybe cursed, but not doomed. ;)
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby Koopa Troopa » February 7, 2018, 2:37 pm

Tank these nuts, Perry and Mills are morons.

Lose lose lose, dont develop your young talent, draft another bust. Trade young guys for dirt. Acquire bench players for 70 million in free agency. Rinse repeat.

Aint a new beginning until new management or even better....new ownership is in town.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 2:42 pm

Cmon Spree,you arent the only guy here who takes a strategic approach..you may be the only one who believes in modeling..Been there done that.Thanks,but no thanks..
You were good with us getting shitty 2nd rounders and a late first round draft pick....I HATE that path... Its the road to perpetual mediocrity

Your dont deviate from your strategic approach,even if you would get edge in a trade. I respect that,but don't agree. You wouldn't trade the number 12 pick for Aaron Gordon. I would, you wouldnt,and we both agree Orlando would never do that. Because hes worth way more than the number 12 pick,yet you wouldnt pull the trigger...

I understand your thought process,and even if I did not,that does not mean your strategic approach is the way to go......







spree#8 wrote:
Tao, I was probably on the tank brigade well before anyone among Knicks fans back in 2003. It's my saying that "in the NBA you have to chose, when to lose". So my approach hasn't changed a lick. The situation has because of an injury. That's all. I am pretty consistent. But you won't understand, because you like to argue and don't like to think clearly about my strategic approach. So whatever. Call it however you want to call it.

And BTW: if the team surprises us until KP comes back, I still won't be mad. We are not doomed. Maybe cursed, but not doomed. ;)
Last edited by taowave on February 7, 2018, 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 2:49 pm

What nice players are you referring to??

Frank??
Kanter??
Hardaway??

What do you think Kanter gets us in a trade??
How about Tim?
Frank??

We haves some mediocre pieces..Hece our shit record..

Your first assumption is KP comes back 100% from his injury,and its not a given.Far from it.I do hope you are right.

Almost every team has a first rounder..You are supposed to have one,unless your GM is Zeke or the other idiot who traded for Bargs..Possessing a first rounder shouldt get a medal.

So we are back to Tanking,whether it be intentional or not,and with our fingers crossed for KP's coming back at full strength.

We are starting over,and you of all people should see it,as you modeled a 30 win season WITH KP


spree#8 wrote:
Why are you so down? Of course the KP injury is tragic news and I'm sad that he will be out for maybe a year, but the franchise is in a fine position going forward with all first-round picks for the next years on deck and some nice players already on the roster. No reason to feel bad. It won't work like this for us, but just remember that David Robinson's injury allowed the Spurs to tank for Tim Duncan which was in hindsight the best thing that ever happened to them and led to the Spurs being the most successful regular season team since then and winner of 5 championships. So maybe KP's injury allows us to get exactly the two higher draft picks this year and next we need. Maybe the team grows until KP comes back into a better situation without having to go through a tank next year. We will see.

It's a sad day, but not the end of the world.

We went through much darker times in the last 17 years.
Last edited by taowave on February 7, 2018, 4:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby big_j_NY » February 7, 2018, 3:37 pm

H20Knick wrote:Yep. that's exactly what it feels like to me. A real chance at back to back top 8 picks with KP coming back into it at the end. We need an elite floor general. We need an elite wing. KP can come back to be the Love/Bosh that puts us over the top. We have to draft well though. No Jan Veseleys. We have the chance to be Durant/Westbrook/Harden but with Dolan's pocketbook to keep them all on the same team


It is still sad it took a broken ACL from KP to get EVERYONE on the Tank Train............the worst case scenario injury I hoped KP would avoid (this and a broken achilles like Cousins has, which will affect Boogie a lot more for the rest of his career).

Now we actually get the true clean slate we wanted, and we'll have a recovering, rehabbing KP finally waiting backstage while we actually fill the slate up again.
#EmbraceTheTank2019

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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 4:06 pm

J,those numnuts will cling on to their "beliefs" for dear life...

FYI,its a torn ligament,not broken...If its broke,we are fucked :relief:
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby big_j_NY » February 7, 2018, 4:12 pm

taowave wrote:J,those numnuts will cling on to their "beliefs" for dear life...

FYI,its a torn ligament,not broken...If its broke,we are fucked :relief:


With this franchise, torn and broken are almost the same exact thing unfortunately. When has a Knicks player (drafted, signed or traded) ever recovered from major injuries back to their dominant pre-injury state in successful fashion?

This is not even pessimistic, this is realistic
#EmbraceTheTank2019

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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby taowave » February 7, 2018, 4:16 pm

Spot on J,which is why I am super concerned with this injury..Everyone acts like its a guaranty he comes back like nothing ever happened.The guy is slightly injury prone and no Adrian Petersen...

This is horrible horrible news


big_j_NY wrote:
With this franchise, torn and broken are almost the same exact thing unfortunately. When has a Knicks player (drafted, signed or traded) ever recovered from major injuries back to their dominant pre-injury state in successful fashion?

This is not even pessimistic, this is realistic
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby Don Che » February 7, 2018, 4:20 pm

pressure is on also, because if he comes back and doesnt play like he did...will the knicks still throw the max?...its just a delicate situation but we'll deal with that next year....only good thing now is....June 2018 draft is gonna be LIT
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby big_j_NY » February 7, 2018, 4:23 pm

Well, the only thing we can hope is that during KP's rehab process.........KP actually studies how to legitimately adjust his playing style.

Running and slashing to the rim like a 7 foot 3 shooting guard is no longer the playing style he can sustain if he wants to remain healthy for the rest of his career, especially since ANY ACL INJURY will dramatically reduce a NBA big man's foot speed to where KP is no longer quick enough to do such things.

In other words, this injury is a blessing in disguise apparently..........because it'll force KP to realize he will have to accept playing like a true 7 foot 3 inch CENTER for the rest of his career since he will be no longer "quick enough" to play power forward.
#EmbraceTheTank2019

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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby Don Che » February 8, 2018, 9:55 am

thats a scary transition in a short amount of time.

what I mean is, asking a player to rehab his ACL and gain a certain amount of weight to withstand the center position not even on a weight level but actual strength level..im not sure its possible for him to conquer those things unless he takes next year off completely
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby gradyandrew » February 21, 2018, 6:58 am

Over the next 23 games it seems like it will be guys auditioning for a role on next seasons team. The only two guys who really are important are Kanter and Hardaway. I'm pretty optimistic that Lee and Thomas can be traded over this summer, hopefully for expirings or just in a salary dump to a team over the cap. Hardaway will be starting for as long as he is here and the Knicks will need to make a decision about whether or not they will resign him after next season. Since Frank and Mudiay won't be making teams pay for leaving them open at the 3 point line, the key play to watch will be witch of the two operates more efficiently with Kanter in the pick and roll. Since both are below average at the rim (so far) we just have to wait and see which of the two can show enough improvement to make the Kanter pick and roll an effective weapon.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby spree#8 » February 21, 2018, 7:47 am

Just one tidbit: Thomas is basically an expiring next season. Of his 19-20 salary just a mill is guaranteed. Keeping Lee for the remainder of his contract would also not hurt although he is obvously on the market in the right deal.
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Re: Anyone else wake up this morning feeling like we are legitimately starting over?

Postby gradyandrew » February 21, 2018, 9:12 am

spree#8 wrote:Just one tidbit: Thomas is basically an expiring next season. Of his 19-20 salary just a mill is guaranteed. Keeping Lee for the remainder of his contract would also not hurt although he is obvously on the market in the right deal.


Thanks for the input. I thought it was a team option, but spotrac didn't have it listed as so. So thanks for cleaning that up.
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