The future of the Atlantic divsion

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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby taowave » November 23, 2017, 11:56 am

I get where Spree is coming from,and I agree for different reasons.

To me a trade is a trade,and in any trade one hopes to get value at a fair price if not a discount.There is a reason the Spurs have been so good for so long.The problem is it seems like obtaining a Kyrie is the exception to the rule,while the Currrys are more the norm in our case.





gradyandrew wrote:taowave, it's the double down aspect which spree is opposed to. as long as you're trading players, you're still able to capitalize on however things work out on the court. But once you start trading future draft picks, you're really rolling the dice, because if you do suck, you'll be sucking for even longer. my guess is gm spree would be cool with trade deadline pick trades because at that point at least the range would be more limited.

His point is that no one is that much of a savant that they should be doubling down. (Unless it's Isiah). There is only so long you should theoretically suck for if you're drafting the likes of lamarcus Aldridge, joakim Noah, gordan Hayward and so on.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby spree#8 » November 23, 2017, 3:05 pm

gradyandrew wrote:taowave, it's the double down aspect which spree is opposed to. as long as you're trading players, you're still able to capitalize on however things work out on the court. But once you start trading future draft picks, you're really rolling the dice, because if you do suck, you'll be sucking for even longer. my guess is gm spree would be cool with trade deadline pick trades because at that point at least the range would be more limited.

His point is that no one is that much of a savant that they should be doubling down. (Unless it's Isiah). There is only so long you should theoretically suck for if you're drafting the likes of lamarcus Aldridge, joakim Noah, gordan Hayward and so on.


Good post. Yeah, I have not much of a problem trading first-round picks when you have a grasp of the actual value of those picks. But the risk of trading future picks away when you have only a vague and short-term plan how to improve from being bad is almost always too high.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Championship 16/17 » November 24, 2017, 1:09 pm

Really good posts from gradyandrew throughout this topic, cosigned a 100% percent of it.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby taowave » November 24, 2017, 4:12 pm

Spree,here is the thing..As we know firsthand,if a GM makes a trade with only a vague and short term plan,hes probably a very bad GM and halfway out the door.

More to the point,in trading,if you are taking down more volatility = greater uncertainty,any decent trader/GM will make adjustments to buffer the potential volatility of the trade. One example is protecting the pick. In the financial markets its adjusting your position size as you take on more unceretainty.I fully agree that as you take on more risk,you adjust accordingly,or don't make the trade.

spree#8 wrote:
Good post. Yeah, I have not much of a problem trading first-round picks when you have a grasp of the actual value of those picks. But the risk of trading future picks away when you have only a vague and short-term plan how to improve from being bad is almost always too high.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Stressin » November 24, 2017, 7:43 pm

Right now .. The Atlantic Division are the Hottest winning Division in the league ..
NBA teams are not happy playing any of the Atlantic Division teams these days, even the Brooklyn Nets has been snatching more wins then expected.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby gradyandrew » November 26, 2017, 10:25 am

taowave, what kind of financial instrument do you think mimics a draft pick? Because I keep thinking that the NBA different than the market in that the biggest losers get one of the biggest prizes. I'd rank making the conference finals above getting the number one pick, but I think most years I'd prefer the number one to elite eight/ playoff second round.

I don't know what the exact cut off is for each team, but at some point it makes more sense to lose thanwin. So trading unprotected future draft picks (without even the 'when bad' caveat) has that possibilityof costing way more than the average value, especially if it's multiple years in a row because then you don't get any chance to recover.

So what's a financial instrument with a fixed payout (the player being acquired) but a variable cost?
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby ISIAH_THOMAS » January 6, 2018, 12:24 am

This team is way back

They are going to need a lot to keep up with Philly and Boston

Don't sleep on Brooklyn either with a full healthy team they could be decent next year and Atkinson can coach
TAKE THAT FOR DATA
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby shakespeare » January 7, 2018, 9:54 am

ISIAH_THOMAS wrote:
They are going to need a lot to keep up with Philly and Boston



I was thinking the same after watching highlights of the '18 Draft expected lottery picks. Celtics and Sixers are gonna add to their already talented pool of present and future All-NBAers.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby taowave » January 7, 2018, 1:56 pm

It's a path dependent option.Let me think for a moment and moment..In plain vanilla terms,you are short volatily at seemingly attractive price..Fixed return,but could explode in your face.

gradyandrew wrote:taowave, what kind of financial instrument do you think mimics a draft pick? Because I keep thinking that the NBA different than the market in that the biggest losers get one of the biggest prizes. I'd rank making the conference finals above getting the number one pick, but I think most years I'd prefer the number one to elite eight/ playoff second round.

I don't know what the exact cut off is for each team, but at some point it makes more sense to lose thanwin. So trading unprotected future draft picks (without even the 'when bad' caveat) has that possibilityof costing way more than the average value, especially if it's multiple years in a row because then you don't get any chance to recover.

So what's a financial instrument with a fixed payout (the player being acquired) but a variable cost?
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Championship 16/17 » February 4, 2018, 9:33 am

Championship 16/17 wrote:
That doesn't mean anything to you?

1. Bc those players where average, Kyrie is great and he will be the MVP this season.

2.Brad Stevens system is great and it maximized average players talent to the ECF in the weak east. You put great system with great talent, you have the anecdote. There not a good team right now, their a great team. 1st in the league in defense foo.

3. I feel Boston can beat the Cavs in a 7 series game RIGHT NOW. Boston needs one more player to take them over the hump (watch what happens around the trade deadline) to offset the players Cavs will get back from injury. It's a long season.

4. Avery Bradley is an average player and has taking that winning culture with him to Detroit from Brad Stevens. But Coach Stan Van Gundy system is average too, they have a good record bc of the combination if good average players. The dont have the anecdote, they are overachieving right now, they will drop back down to 5 or 6th team. Between average and good. Lastly, I would say Tobias Harris is leading that group not Bradley, from the one game I saw against the knicks.


Ladies & gentlemen, you have a new Eastern Conference champion with the addition of Greg Monroe. I said the Celtics was one player away, any other additions from now to the trade deadline is just icying on the cake. You heard it here first :popcorn:
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby shakespeare » February 4, 2018, 10:21 am

Greg Monroe is still in the league?
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Red » February 4, 2018, 10:58 am

Still they'll probably lose to GS or HOU.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Championship 16/17 » February 4, 2018, 1:45 pm

shakespeare wrote:Greg Monroe is still in the league?


Yes, he is, an watch how great he will become in Brad Stevens system. Greg Monroe is no scrub and I expect him to replace Haynes in the starting lineup.

YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST, THE CELTICS WILL BEAT LEBRON AND THE CAVS IN THE PLAYOFFS. PEOPLE WILL THEN QUESTION THE GREATNESS OF LEBRON IF HE DIDNT HAVE WADE OR IRVING ON HIS TEAM, TWO CLOSURES WHEN THE GAME IN ON THE LINE. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON, NO EXCUSE FOR LEBRON TO LOSE TO KYRIE, BUT IT WILL HAPPEN HIS SEASON AND I CANT WAIT TO HEAR WHAT EXCUSE LEBRON COMES UP WITH.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby dcapodic » February 4, 2018, 4:48 pm

Championship 16/17 wrote:Yes, he is, an watch how great he will become in Brad Stevens system. Greg Monroe is no scrub and I expect him to replace Haynes in the starting lineup.

YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST, THE CELTICS WILL BEAT LEBRON AND THE CAVS IN THE PLAYOFFS. PEOPLE WILL THEN QUESTION THE GREATNESS OF LEBRON IF HE DIDNT HAVE WADE OR IRVING ON HIS TEAM, TWO CLOSURES WHEN THE GAME IN ON THE LINE. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON, NO EXCUSE FOR LEBRON TO LOSE TO KYRIE, BUT IT WILL HAPPEN HIS SEASON AND I CANT WAIT TO HEAR WHAT EXCUSE LEBRON COMES UP WITH.


You can't take it away from Lebron but I started thinking along these same lines :) Who was it that made the big shot/plays at the end against GSW in the series they won? That's right....Kyrie :)
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby H20Knick » February 4, 2018, 11:18 pm

im pretty sure i said that when kyrie ended up in boston but yeah. celtics to the ECFs and kyrie should've been a knick at all costs
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Rusty La Rue » February 5, 2018, 3:58 am

Championship 16/17 wrote:Ladies & gentlemen, you have a new Eastern Conference champion with the addition of Greg Monroe. I said the Celtics was one player away, any other additions from now to the trade deadline is just icying on the cake. You heard it here first :popcorn:


I think you are right... The only thing that can save the CAVS are that Isiah Thomas wants payback and goes into MVP mode against his old team...

It is of course always nice to reach the finals... but we already know who will be champions come June as nobody will beat GSW...
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby Championship 16/17 » February 5, 2018, 9:21 am

H20Knick wrote:im pretty sure i said that when kyrie ended up in boston but yeah. celtics to the ECFs and kyrie should've been a knick at all costs


I said the same thing brother, go back to my post. I was quite upset Irving wasn't a Knick and was adamant that Celtics won that trade the day it happened.
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby nazrmohamed » February 5, 2018, 9:55 am

H20Knick wrote:im pretty sure i said that when kyrie ended up in boston but yeah. celtics to the ECFs and kyrie should've been a knick at all costs


In hindsight you're probably right but remember we didn't know Hardaway would-be as good as he's been (current slump withstanding), I never knew Frank would be so much of a non factor. We didn't even know we'd definitely be trading Melo so at least I thought it looked like a bandaid move while trading away essentially 2 lottery picks if you include Frank. Oh well, I was wrong but I'd rather be wrong and still have youth and A future rather than be stuck
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby taowave » February 5, 2018, 10:11 am

Naz,I'm starting to think Hardaway is an illusion..He teases you with a hot stretch,we fall for it and then he hits a brutal cold patch..

At the end of the day,when you look a his Numbers and our record,he's basically mediocre and most likely overpaid..
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Re: The future of the Atlantic divsion

Postby ISIAH_THOMAS » March 28, 2018, 9:29 pm

A long way from relevance

Celtics sixers look like future of east

Raptors are not going anywhere right now
TAKE THAT FOR DATA
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